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Author Topic: 75g Predator tank--not for the squeemish  (Read 18353 times)
turtletoes
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« on: July 27, 2008, 02:00:45 AM »

Hi all. Smiley

I'm about to set up a tank like I Never dreamed of!! Smiley

A 75g predator tank. The main reason for this is to keep a "cullinator". A large fish, or multiple fish whole can eat fry/smaller fish who are not suitable for sale or trade due to deformities.

I've thought long and hard on this. And, I'd rather have a large fish to feed the culls to than place the culls in a freezer.(not that I've had to cull anything yet. been very lucky in that respect.)

A few fish I have considered, but do not know if they would be suited for a 75g are:
Pumkin Sunfish
Frontosa
Large Tinfoil Barb(s)
Large shark-type catfish??
?????

Or, maybe a few sinlge large not so aggressive, but big-mouthed fish that could live in harmony together, but could swallow up to a 1 inch fish whole.

Or, a breeding group of larger cichlids who would revel in the oportunity for some occasional live foods??(I've kept very few cichlids in my life. And, actually, I dont think I'd call the way I cared for them as "keeping them" by my current standards. I've learned Volumes of info since the last time I had any cichlid in any of my tanks--well, besides the satanoperca leucosticta)

Since I have never kept these types of fish, I am looking for all the info I can find. Any personal experiences would be greatly appreciated. Or, even daydreaming thoughts of what you'd put in a 75g if you could keep any predatory/opportunistic eating fish you wanted. Smiley

I am bound to use this 75g tank. It will be in the center of my small fish room and viewed from the front and back of the tank. If I need to make rockwork that will take up a large volume of tank water, I can always put a 30g tank below for a sump/freshwater refugium type set up and allow for a little more water volume.

Any ideas?? Smiley I've seen some amazing and gorgeous fish in my search. Now, its time to get some input from some pros. Smiley

Lastly, someone today suggested Turtles........any ideas on that one? I think turtles are Cool, and I'd have a Blast setting up a little environment for them. Smiley

Thanks
~Lori
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VĭиŏиMăĭ₣
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« Reply #1 on: July 27, 2008, 02:29:22 AM »

Hey Lori I think that is a fantastic and practical idea. I like your thinking.

I have no idea what a sunfish is.
I don't know what your 75 dimensions are.
I have an 80g and I wouldn't house any other fish on your list in the tank.
Now I may just be being conservative. But I don't consider my 80g as a tank that really has that much space in it...

Some of the 5-6" catfish would definitely be a goer IMO. The ones with spots on....ummm don't know their name lmao
Mystus spp. maybe?


Oh and there is an article in the library about turtles. They definitely need a lot more than a little environment Smiley
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tom14
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« Reply #2 on: July 27, 2008, 06:51:32 AM »

what about an oscar or jack depsey or some other larger solitary/pairing cichlid, in fact any cichlid would eat fry most likely if given the chance. frotosa, as far as im aware, like to live in groups and grow rather large and need very large tanks. the others i have no idea.
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gomezaddams
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Sharing water brings us closer


« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2008, 08:45:00 AM »

Oscars are very personable and will beg like a puppy and in general be more interested in you than anything in thier tank.But they are unpredictable and sometimes choose to keep one or more of the feeders as pets!
Depending on the size of the feeders some of the dwarf to medium size pike cichlids would happily eat your culls.
I have crenicichla proteus and they are pretty cool fish.
I have a coworker with a pet alligator that I send my larger culls to!

Frontosa are a poor choice,in the wild thier feeding method is to wait for thier prey to go to sleep then pick them off.They are not good hunters.
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livebearerfanatic
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« Reply #4 on: July 27, 2008, 10:22:15 AM »

pumpkinseed sunfish  (as we call them in michigan)  are fish that you catch in lakes and EAT!  they're temperate water fish.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2008, 09:49:53 AM by russ » Logged
Kim
pita sandwhich
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« Reply #5 on: July 27, 2008, 10:28:05 AM »

How big of culls are we talking about here?

I have always wanted to keep a Ctenopoma in the conditions it's meant to be kept in. Smiley My brain hasn't fully kicked in yet or I'd give you a full name, it's the one commonly referred to as "leopard". But I think they only get to about 6".

They're stalkers and most definately eaters of small fishes from what I've read. They like to hide deep in plants and then jump out and grab them.

anyway, obviously they would only work for small culls, if you're gonna put a two incher in there it probably wouldn't work. Smiley  But I think a couple or few in a moderately planted tank would be cool.
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metanis
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Tanks: 46G: pair of german blue rams, 3 julii cory cats, pair of keyhole cichlids, 1 gourami 90G:leopard ctenopoma, striped raphael catfish, 40G Fry grow out, 10G QT
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« Reply #6 on: July 27, 2008, 10:34:41 AM »

i definitely agree with the leopard ctenopoma...i have one in my tank.  she is a juvenile right now, but when she gets bigger she will be my excuse for upping tank size:)  she is an amazing fish to watch as she has very unique tendencies.  she loves following around this feeder guppy i have had for a couple years that has survived somehow.  even tho she can't eat the guppy, she stalks her around the tank waiting until she is big enough.  also, datnoids are gorgeous fish, although i think they might get too big for a 75gal.  good luck, and i would definitely recommend a few leopard ctenopomas or striped ctenopomas
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Kim
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« Reply #7 on: July 27, 2008, 10:50:06 AM »

ooh, metanis,  what a great way to keep that swordtail population down!
Now I want one even more, lol.
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RTR...Grumpy Ole Fogie
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« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2008, 11:06:41 AM »

A male front would be my personal choice, but a 75 is just not big enough for an adult.  how about a 120? 

For the 75 I would not go past an Oscar.  They are common, but highly personable and are real pets.  Gender does not matter.
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Kim
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« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2008, 12:06:21 PM »

Ctenopoma acutirostre.  Smiley

They really are interesting fish. Apparently they have huge mouths and will eventually eat everything  smaller then themselves.
Not terribly fond of each other but can live with peaceful fish their own size.
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turtletoes
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« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2008, 01:54:04 PM »

Is this the fish we are talking about?? Smiley

http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/e_Ctenopoma_acutirostre.php

I stumbled across this beauty a week or so ago. I would love to have a pair of them in a 75g tank if thats do-able. Smiley

The tank is an older 75g. Its 48 inches x18 inches, I think 18 inches deep. The glass is thicker than they use now, so there is no crossbar. I am limited to this tank, as it is kind of an indulgence since my fish room is quite small(13ftx10fft). Hubby would rather see this tank as a grow out, but I'd rather have something in it that can eat the culls when needed, and be ok on frozens when I dont have any culls.

The culls would be from guppies, raibowfish, endlers, or a variety of smaller fish that I am breeding....so, it doesnt have to be a Huge fish. By the time the fish are an inch, it should be obvious as to whether or not they are keepers.

I'm not sure that any fish would be suitable for bn pleco culls, but I dont forsee that being something I need to do often. I've only seen one bent spine out of several hundred bn babes, and he disappeared a day or 2 after I noticed him.

I'd also consider keeping a pair/group of some sort of cichlid in there. But, not having really kept any cichlids before, I dont know where to start on that search. The only reason I asked about Frontosa is because I saw 1st place winner large male specimen at a buddy's house and was just blown away!! This fish was housed in a 120g(similar dimensions to my 75, just 6 inches deeper and 6 inches wider front to back......) The guy thought the fish Might be ok in a 75g, but after I researched them some, I didnt think it was a good idea because they really need a bigger tank, and like someone said, the way they hunt their prey probably isnt the best for getting those fast little culls)

I've also considered an oscar. But, have never kept them and wasnt sure if they were suited for a 75g tank. I'm willing to go that route, but only if I am unable to find something more different. Smiley

thanks for all the suggestions!! Keep em comin!! Smiley Or if anyone has any pics of their leopard ctenopoma or the tank they keep them in, that would be awesome! Smiley I've seen a variety of "leaf fish" at different LFS, but they never have a proper ID on them. I cant say for certain that I've ever seen these fish in person before. I'm guessing a private breeder is the way to go about getting one or a pair....??

thanks!! I'm Really excited now!! Smiley
~Lori

 
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Kim
pita sandwhich
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« Reply #11 on: July 27, 2008, 03:29:40 PM »

I would also love to have a pair in a 75. Smiley

A while back Petsmart was carrying them, this was a couple years ago. I doubt you'll see much in the way of private breeders but you might see them on Aquabid from some of the private importers.  Either that or see if an lfs will get them in for you.

whaddya know....http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwanabantoid&1217455200
« Last Edit: July 27, 2008, 03:37:55 PM by Kim » Logged

JOKER
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« Reply #12 on: July 27, 2008, 03:49:03 PM »

oscars really very.  mine is big, fat and lazy and isnt territorial so I can put pretty much anything in with him.  I have some feeder fish in their and they arent getting eaten because he doesnt want to eat them.  and nothing else in the tank eats until he is done eating.

so oscars can go both ways, sometimes you can keep things with them and sometimes you cant. 
my tank is a bit overstocked in general but since the oscar isnt territorial,  I can do more.
I have kept oscars for a long time and if you want to go that way, and you want other fish in their, be sure to add them when the oscar is young. 
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turtletoes
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« Reply #13 on: July 27, 2008, 05:01:10 PM »

Kim, now that you mention it, I have seen what looks like these fish at my local petsmart. But, its been a year or more since they had them in......sometimes they get pretty cool fish. i also remember them being very expensive($30+??) Thanks for the link to the auction on them. Smiley They look so cute as little ones........I wonder how many I should start with?? To get a pair of them, is it best to start with like 6 or more and let them grow and then pair off?? Or if I find a male and a female(how do you sex them??) can I just put a pair in the tank from the start??

Thanks again guys Smiley
~Lori
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Kim
pita sandwhich
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« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2008, 05:06:10 PM »

I don't know how to sex them, I've only researched them a bit because they're a fish that's always interested me, one of the hits I got on google though said just that, to get a group of youngsters. I don't think they pair bond like cichlids , you probably just get a group and grow em out until you can sex them.

here's a nice little write up

http://www.aquarticles.com/articles/breeding/Marshall_Leopard_Bushfish.html

and another good one

http://articles.gpasi.org/ctenopoma_acutirostre.html

good profile..ooh, congo tetra's would be good tank mates it says. Wouldn't those be pretty?  Smiley

http://www.seriouslyfish.com/profile.php?genus=Ctenopoma&species=acutirostre
« Last Edit: July 27, 2008, 05:26:39 PM by Kim » Logged

metanis
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Tanks: 46G: pair of german blue rams, 3 julii cory cats, pair of keyhole cichlids, 1 gourami 90G:leopard ctenopoma, striped raphael catfish, 40G Fry grow out, 10G QT
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« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2008, 05:38:14 PM »

ill try to get a couple pictures of my ctenopoma up tonight when i get home.  i'm not sure how to sex them either, but they are great fish...i absolutely love watching her.  i've seen some at petsmart for around $10 or $11...but that is starting at about an inch and a half or so.  if you buy an older one...closer to 3 inches, you will probably pay close to 30. good luck!!!
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Mr T Rides BMX
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« Reply #16 on: July 27, 2008, 06:07:55 PM »

Gulpers  Smiley
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metanis
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Gender: Male
Tanks: 46G: pair of german blue rams, 3 julii cory cats, pair of keyhole cichlids, 1 gourami 90G:leopard ctenopoma, striped raphael catfish, 40G Fry grow out, 10G QT
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« Reply #17 on: July 28, 2008, 08:13:19 AM »

how do you upload pictures onto a reply?  im a total computer dummy
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metanis
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Gender: Male
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« Reply #18 on: July 28, 2008, 08:37:53 AM »

here is a pic of our ctena hanging by her castle



[attachment deleted by admin to increase space]
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VĭиŏиMăĭ₣
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« Reply #19 on: July 28, 2008, 08:52:46 AM »

A very stunning fish. It even looks like you don't want to mess with it Smiley
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Kim
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« Reply #20 on: July 28, 2008, 09:50:23 AM »

nice pic metanis!
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turtletoes
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« Reply #21 on: July 28, 2008, 11:13:32 AM »

Thanks for the pic!! Smiley Where did you get your fish?? I'm gonna have to go out scouring the all LFS in a 50 mile radius this week!! Smiley I'm Very excited!! Smiley

~Lori
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Zach
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« Reply #22 on: July 28, 2008, 03:08:26 PM »

I would reccomend some kind of bicher.
they are fun, big (but not huge), and will eat anything the size of their head.  happy
but I also agree with the climbing perch suggestion.
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metanis
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Gender: Male
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« Reply #23 on: July 28, 2008, 03:15:18 PM »

i got her from a local store called preuss pets in lansing, mi.  they also sell them here in east lansing at petsmart, but that might just be a local deal, i'm not sure.  good luck finding one!!!
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turtletoes
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« Reply #24 on: July 28, 2008, 03:23:55 PM »

Thanks..........

What are suitable tankmates for the "leopard bushfish"(too lazy to look at how to spell the scientific name again! :P )?? Could I have a bichir too?? Smiley I dont think so, I'll go look them up..........I had forgotten I wanted a bichir tank!! lol. In the long run, I dont think that 75g is big enough for a big bichir or bichir(s) though.........that would be too cool if it were ok.

See?? THATS why I posted this thread!! So I could be reminded off all the Cool Big fish eating fish I havent ever kept before!! Smiley

thanks again! Smiley
~Lori
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